Agent Essentials

Shop Talk - The Real Estate Agent Podcast


Real Estate Agent Podcast Episode 90: Shift Your Mindset and Create Emotional Intelligence with Ben Oosterveld

Ben Oosterveld
April 25, 2022

Ben Oosterveld is the President and CEO of Agent from Within, a company focused on helping real estate agents build successful businesses without sacrificing their personal lives.

 
I teach real estate agents one at a time to connect deeply, emotionally, and focus on keeping one client for the years. Nobody's talking about systems that keep your clients for 20 years.

Ben Oosterveld

About This Episode

Ben Oosterveld is your typical podcast guest. He didn’t have an easy start. He lived on the streets through the age of 14, survived a failed suicide attempt at age 15, and later spent 365 days in rehab. After some serious inner work, Ben began a career in real estate where he built a multi-million-dollar real estate business with an award-winning top national team in 3 years.

Today, Oosterveld is the President and CEO of Agent from Within, a company focused on helping real estate agents build successful businesses without sacrificing their personal lives. Oosterveld helps business owners get clear about who they really are and what they really want.

Learn more about Ben Oosterveld on his website. Connect with him on Facebook and LinkedIn. Join the VIP list for his new book “The Richest Real Estate Agent; How to Build a Seven-Figure Business without Sacrificing Your Relationships” here

Finally, tune into his podcast The Richest Real Estate Agent, a podcast that covers the biggest problems real estate agents face in the industry today.

Download the free ebook "How to Leverage Technology to Recruit Top Agents" from our sponsor Chime, here

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Episode Transcript

Brett: Hey there and welcome to Shoptalk, the real estate show. I’m Brett Van Alstine and in today’s episode, we’re talking with Ben Oosterveld, President and CEO of Agent From Within. The company’s mission is to help agents build a business that supports a life they love.

We cover Ben’s tumultuous youth, how he worked on himself to become a better person and successful business owner, and his start in real estate. Ben has had plenty of highs and lows, and I can say that he is not the typical podcast guest. Our conversation is entertaining and enlightening, and I think you’ll enjoy his stories, plus his tips for success in today’s real estate industry.

Brett:

Hey, Ben, thanks again for taking the time to hop on the podcast with me today.

Ben:

Yeah. I'm looking forward to it, man. Super, super pumped to be here. Thanks so much for the invite.

Brett:

Of course. So obviously for people that don't know, you've got a pretty unique background story as far as, you know, growing up and how you ultimately got started into real estate. Would you mind for our listeners kind of diving into what your youth looked like and then ultimately what your journey was before you got into real estate?

Ben:

Sure. I'll give a little hook first. So there's some, so people know that you know, I started in real estate when I was, it was 2013. I really started my first year. Within a couple years I made a million bucks. Okay. And I didn't do it with lead gen. I didn't even have a business card. My first month I sold five properties, so kind of a hack. I hacked the system a bit. Sure. And but that's not where it, that's not obviously where it, that started. I, I grew up in a very tough, I was a street kid. Went through a lot, man. I spent 365 days in, in a rehab center for you know, in failed suicide attempt at 15 years old, pretty heavy. So hopefully don't freak people out, but it was, it was just, just a broken person and it was unfair, you know, it's a child, a very fair what I've went through and, and yeah, it was hopelessness until I realized I wanted to live.

Ben:

And yeah, after, after I got outta the rehab center and all this, I started building a life and, and I think that shaped me more than anything else, which is kind of one of those. Like I have a, I have a model that life is perfect. Even though it sounds pretty crazy, but I got some right to that. because I've had the I've I've paid the dues in a sense. So life is perfect because I wouldn't be on this podcast. I wouldn't be helping people. I wouldn't be doing what I do without having that origin story. And I think that we need to overcome the, the greatest momentum and the biggest doubles and triples and business and everything comes from the, from the over ourselves so it's very much into psychology. And through that process, I really understand people.

Ben:

I spent, I spent a decade like I'm now what? Two or three decades? Almost just trying to figure my out and the side effect though, was really interesting. I got super confident, I got super self aware. I had to figure out I just wanted to be normal Brett. Like I just woke up every day with rage and anger and I just wanted to be happy, you know? And sure. And so, but I was ridiculously driven. Part of that was the psychology from the past where the only time you got attention from your family was when you were working hard or accomplishing things. So it really frames the inner game. And it's really important to understand what work in game is because it's, it's playing out, whether you like it or not. And so we work so, so I understand people very well.

Ben:

I, I love human behavior. I'm certified in, in, in some psychology stuff that I've done. I'm not a psychologist, but it's my obsession as humans and behavior and connection and understanding of how we'd work. And I just, I just, I just went into sales, crushed at sales, but again, ironically, my dad was a top sales guy, so I still, the subconscious was playing out but I learned a lot and I learned how to sell and cold call. And I went through the grind and hustler beyond, and, and I found rich dad, poor dad. And I started thinking, oh, this is awesome. Quit my job just blindly. And I started doing real estate and within 14 months at 40 properties, just insane. And ended up with 61 with a whole hell of a lot more transactions than that. And then the crash hit.

Ben:

Okay. And I was going full speed. Like I was young and, and very a good communicator. I understand humans, but nowhere near what I am today, like I just, you didn't know where, where, where I was going, but I, I, it was unbelievable what happened when I, I hit the crash there. I, I just realized that, like I had good investments. I good investors, but I never was ready to deal with 20 investors saying, Ben, we wanna sell, we want our money back. And I'm saying, I can't give that to you. Being a people, pleaser. It crushed my identity. It, it, it broke me down, but in a weird place that needed to happen, it was a very deep self expiration. And I, and I became a business coach and I started working with people. I redid my, I, I, I sold off some rental properties.

Ben:

I've got a nice little portfolio today, not 61, but I had to make some very hard. So I navigated it. And at the end of the day though, I, I really fell in love with, working with business owners and, and people. And, and what I realized though, was that the real estate industry was, was lacking. Massively when it comes to business. Okay. And so I would, I'd see a lot of hustlers burn out. I'd see a lot of relationships falling apart, but then I'd, I'd see the, I'd see agents thinking they could do it all. And I started working with agents and really niching out. And I became an agent and I thought, what are we ever cool? If, as a coach, I would actually start and show my system and actually do it live. And so we did, I got 10 agents and I said, I've gotta coach you.

Ben:

This would be the only time you've ever seen this happen. The only time it was once cause starting sucks. There's nothing fun about it and I'm gonna get it done. And so that's when I was obviously pretty motivated because I had coaching clients watching me every week and yeah, I became rookie of the year for the entire area. And that's just a ridiculous amount of sales and all this stuff. But I hired an assistant before I even, I think my, by my third sale, I had an assistant because I knew building a business. I knew business coaching. I didn't approach it as a salesman, even though I, that was a strong point. I approached it as a business guy. So I hired an assistant too pretty much when I started. because why would you ever like start a restaurant and cook, you know, serve the dishes, clean the parking lot, like a business you have to put in some systems and build a team.

Ben:

I DIDNT think any the other way and it was, it, it created such a competitive edge. Cause I was never burning out. I could do twice as much work and I only paid, you know, 10, 15 grand for an a, and it like for part-time and it just opened up so much. So anyway, long story short being coaching. I mean, I, I, I, I was real estate for nine years. I built up the company and became one of the top teams in all of Western Canada and I sold the company. That was always my mission. I never wanted to be a real estate agent. I've always wanted to be a coach and, and to help people. And I run retreats now and we do personal growth and we do business coaching. And so that's been the story. It's a real short, short version of a long, 20 years, 30 years. So 40, what am I now? 41 now. So, but yeah, really, really hitting our stride here with the coaching. We're helping people all over North America right now, all real estate agents.

Brett:

That's awesome to hear. And like you had said that's certainly a part of the industry and part of the business that isn't talked about much. Yeah. for what of a reason, but certainly is one of the more important things to talk about. And one of the things that people, I think every agent, not even, even successful ones, they all need that and they all need to hear it. So that's, that's a, that's really great to hear. And your story is pretty inspiring. I think for a lot of people.

Ben:

Yeah. Thanks Brad. It's funny. I just got off the phone with a real estate broker. He had very successful broker. He just sold his Remax office and retired he seventies. So I called him and, and we talked about, talked about my business and, and, and different things like that. And he just pretty much said it was really funny to hear he's such a good guy believes in what I do and he knows it works. He's had me speak a few times and he says, just, you know, Ben, nobody wants to talk about mine's set. And no one wants to talk about relationships. You might wanna change your branding. And I'm like, huh, mean, the guy means a lot to me. Like his words mean a lot, and I thought about it and I wrestled with it and I'm like, no, no, they just don't know. They like, he goes, it'll be a tougher road. And I'm like, that's fine. But you should see what's happening in people's lives. Like it's working or the other way create some sales transaction training. And then everyone signs up and you have no results.

Brett:

Right, right.

Ben:

I'm sorry. I can't. So I believe one at a time would blow their minds. That's my strategy, same, same strategy. I teach real estate agents one at a time to connect deeply, emotionally and blow their minds and focus on keeping one client for the years. That's a huge missing hole. Focus on a client. Like most people are like transactions. How do we convert better? How do our, our list and our, our which lead gen how what listings, how do you get more lists and tell you, how about keep one client for 20 years? Nobody's talking about systems that keep your clients for 20 years. The same thing I'm doing in my real estate world, I'm building it a tribe. And if I want, if I want a real estate agent, I help them. I need to really help them.

Ben:

And then what happens? They tell their friends and then we have systems in place to always have our tribe. And, and, and if you think about it, I coached a one guy. He was 30 some years in the business Remax, well trained. Okay. And when I started talking to him about, I said, how are you, how are you getting your, a client experience to the point where they're aggressively saying, you seriously need to hire John and you should fire your other agent. You should definitely hire John. I said, what are you doing to create that ex that reaction? Right? And he goes, I don't know. I just, I just banging out deals. I said, cool. I said, how many, how many people on your, how many transactions have you done? He goes, well, well, over a thousand, like, well, over I said, let's just say a thousand. What if you had a 5% referral rate? Yeah. How many sales would you have? And they said 50. I said, what's your average commission? He goes 50.

Ben:

He's a, he's almost a million dollar agent on a zero marketing budget. But guess what he's doing every day, two, $2,000 a month. Crushing lead gen calls at 65 years old, something's broken. Nobody's looking at the end game from the start it's transaction, transaction, transaction, transaction. Oh, I'm so busy. I can't take that CMA. Oh, I forgot to follow up. Oh, I need to be more organized. Oh, I'm procrastinating. No, you're just not building a business. You're trying to do it all. And you have the focus on the front end sale. Not the referral base.

Brett:

Right, right. Well, and it certainly seems like the key takeaway there is ultimately, and this is what I think the industry is all about in the first place, but it's about having those relationships and actually developing them instead of just like you had said, treating it as one transaction that will yeah. Not even lead to the next because you're just so focused on pursuing the next without. Well,

Ben:

Think about what that sounds like. That's the, that's the, that's the play. Hey baby. You wanna have sex with me tonight? Awesome. See ya. <Laugh> like, if you really think about it, the, the relationships take freaking work, dude. Right? I'm married for 19 years. Almost divorced twice. It is hard. And you gotta because you know why? because you know it's missing Brett relationship training. This is, oh, I'm a relationship person. Awesome. How's your marriage? How's your connection with your children? Oh they suck. And you're gonna be a relationship agent. Yeah. Whatever dude. <Laugh> it's it's like they don't even know what it means. I think if I was to start a brokerage, which I never would and hopefully a broker's listening right now, you change the game. You always go for a lawyer or a mortgage broker sitting in and you rent out the office. Great. And bolt model, you get the building and you sublet everything and it's a good business. I love it. But why are we putting a mortgage broker and a lawyer in what if you put a life coach in,

Brett:

Right?

Ben:

What if you put, what if you put a relationship expert in that office working out of a Remax office or a KW office or whatever. What if you had a relationship expert sitting there in your office, guess what recruiting would be like, boy, that'd be different. Hey we believe in actually training you to be an amazing relationship expert. Oh that's different. Or we could do the same thing. Oh, we've got the best training. We've got mastermind meetings and we've got the biggest agents and blah, blah, blah. It's so obvious. If I, if I was a broker, it'd be so easy to win. They're doing all of them are doing the same thing, which is the greatest advantage for someone that wants to make a change. Yeah. Why not actually do what they need as relationship training if this is a relationship game.

Brett:

Yeah. No. And that's, that's, that's a great point. And I think that's obviously again, that's the revolving topic of this is that that's what's missing right now. Yeah. And that's the, the whole that you're filling with what you do and how you help people is you have to kind of ditch this mindset of build, build, build, build, build, and not developing that relationship and actually making those people heard because it comes down to, you know, you wanna listen to them. You gotta, you have to understand kind of what's going on in their mind to better help you. But it's, it's a two way street

Ben:

With the motive though, of relationship not the sale. See, this is the thing, then it's manipulation. Cause I fool you Brett, that I care about you. We can mirror each other. I will mirror you like these are all these strategies like, oh you're laughing now I'll laugh too now. Oh, we're making a connection. Do you like dogs? We gotta find that spot so we can find out where we connect. Oh, loves dogs. I got 'em. I got 'em sign here, here, here. And Brett, you feel like I get you, but it's a sale and are on. You're gonna resent me for it. That's called. That's called sales and I'm I know sales dude. I've been trained on every level, how to close those deals. <Laugh> and I can tell you that I put all those in a bag and I leave 'em alone. I got all the skills.

Ben:

I'm a ninja that doesn't use my sort. You know why? Because, because we wanna, we wanna build a referral base. Sure. If you have to deal with that, some for 20 years you'll deal with 'em differently. You will not use those closing techniques you'll wait till they are ready. And you can say, do you wanna sign here? Let's go. But you're not closing. You're just confirming it because you created a real connection, but the motive is the 20 year relationship. So maybe you don't get the sale this year. You'll get it in two years. Imagine that person you're dealing with you're you'll win the game in the end. It's the tortoise in the hair. You know, the tortoise just plugs away. The hair givers, givers burns out, givers burns out and then the base is never, ever established.

Brett:

So where, when was the point in your career journey where you kind of had that mental aha of this sales technique that I've been doing and that I've been taught? There's something wrong with this. There's gotta be a better way to do business. When, when was that point in your career for you?

Ben:

So when I sold office furniture, I sold two and a half million dollars of office furniture at gunner office F jeans. I landed, I, you know, the, the city, I landed the client as a city. I've landed the Husky oil like I, I Imperial oil. Like I was just so sales works in the way where if I have a product, okay and I need, I need to talk to a thousand people, that system where you talk to a thousand people and get a hundred sales, that still is important. Okay. Sure. It's really, really important. So hustlers, that's why hustlers can win for a while. Cause that works sheer numbers. Yep. So I'll never lose that. But the thing is though, if you're looking at cranking a sail , and you don't need a replete client, it's all conversion strategies. Sure.

Ben:

That's why, and that's fine. I just need you to click here by we're done, but what if you want them to come back for 10 years? Real estate changed for me because you realize, first of all, I became a better human being. That's what happened? I, I stopped manipulating. I found self-awareness. I , realized I was so selfish in everything I was doing. I was a people pleaser. And the thing is, I'll just hit this. Now people pleasing is the most selfish person I know. And the one person I can't trust is the people pleaser. Because if I was, if I have a fear that you're gonna judge me or fear that I'm not gonna be good enough, my own personal standard, I'm gonna gonna give a lot, but not to make you. It's not about you, Brett. It's that you give me the feeling that I need or you just, if I'm nice to you, I'll avoid the feeling of being reject.

Ben:

It's all about me. Right? So there's some deep, deep, personal awarenesses that have I that man, everything I do, I bought my wife flowers. I was a romantic. Why? because I didn't feel loved. And I needed my wife to give me that, that's why the marriage started breaking. because I would do these things for her. And it would be a lie at a subconscious level. Not that I, I did love her and I did wanna buy her flowers. So it's tricky. But I did it ultimately. So I would feel like a good husband. Yeah. It's not about her. So these are some major major. This is why I'm all in on the personal inward game. Because this is the 10 X. Now it's not even the fact that I need to fully change that. That I'm aware that what I'm doing.

Ben:

So I'm now it's almost like having a windshield wiper and you can see now. Oh wow. I'm self-aware oh, that's what I'm doing. Blind spots are the thing we should be hunting for period in business. Sure. What is your blind spot? One decision can take you out. One partnership. One thing you do that, like it's just about understanding that who you are is really, really important. because every decision you make will be through your filter of who you see yourself as. And that's not talked about, unless you go through the road. I went through where I had to dig deep into myself and I started seeing the results. And so I realized that old school sales tactics are, are selfish. And here's what happened is that people got to know what they were do you understand, have you ever had anyone in your life that said they cared about you, but deep down they just wanted to take from you?

Brett:

Yeah, for

Ben:

Sure. Everyone. And that there is one of the most interesting emotional triggers I run into that is a real fighter one. Like if you felt like I was gonna do this to you, Brett, you'd be like, I'm out. Like it would be like, it's almost F you, I have at that happened. You played with my heart. Screw you. That's what sales is without relationship. Yeah. So it turns from, he loves me. I love him. Yes, yes. Oh. He just wanted my sale.

Brett:

Yeah. And then there's a

Ben:

Lot of resentment now, resentment and now they're angry and you wonder why. So, so this is where imagine understanding psychology and human behavior and relationships. So I realized even practically it was actually a really bad strategy to do that. So, and then other, but you know, what's funny. It's like girls that show their boobs all over the internet, get, they get lots of likes. It's the good strategy, right? Sure. But you're not getting what you want. People just wanna see the boobs. And so the problem is they go back to saying, I wanna share some really intellectual thinking no one sees it. So they go back to the old way because they it's almost like the drug. And so sales. Yeah. You can use those techniques to get paid , which gives you the drug. But if you can see 10 years down the way I coach guys at 10 years, 20 years, 30 years, I'm like, if they would've just started, it'd be crazy.

Ben:

I got a guy right now named Coke and he's in Niagara and he, he actually has four team members. One of them's done 60 deals. He has a choice to work or not. He, he has a business that is we've we've we've won't get into little details of it. But it's through YouTube and different things that we helped him build and, and strategize with. But the ultimate thing he's 20, some years old. Wow. He started from the beginning on putting in his systems. When he started working with me, he said, he said, you know, I just, you know, the personal growth steps, that's cool and everything. And I'm, I'm open to it, but I really need to put in this systems, same thing I get with a lot of guys, because they don't understand what they actually need. And that's what I'm trying to shift.

Ben:

That's why I'm on podcasts. That's why I'm out there talking cause you don't understand the real 10 X is somewhere else. Yeah. Like after trying 15 different strategies and you're getting the same result, it might not be the strategy. Right? So with Coke, we actually started working this relationship with this father started working on his inner game of how his insecurities and how they were self-sabotaging he hired three assistants. He did everything I said, but they all quit. <Laugh> every one of them he's like, yeah. Another one quit. And they all had really good reasons. And I said, dude, this is a Coke problem. This is not, this is not a hiring problem. Fourth one, he got, now he's got two assistants. We had to figure out what was relationally wrong in him without a team. So if you wanna build a team, great, let's start with psychology. Sure. Let's start with leadership. Let's start with the relationship you have with yourself, because that's gonna be projected on other people. Long story short he's I think he's cracked a half million dollars already this year and he's and he has sold maybe 5% of his percent of what his team sold. Wow. So he literally, he comes on my retreats with me. He's had a baby, he took a month off with his baby. See, are we trying to be seven figure agents? That's what everyone's selling. Who needs seven figures.

Brett:

Yeah,

Ben:

He has freedom. That's what we're actually looking for. People want a sense or an emotional feeling of security, but emotional feelings can't be solved with a financial number.

Ben:

So they think if I have millions of dollars, I'll finally get rid of that feeling of worry. Right? You're gonna have to deal with worry.

Brett:

There's more to worry about.

Ben:

Like if you could change the worry, you wouldn't have to take the 17 years to try to become a multimillionaire. You could literally start living today. So it's a little bit of a different paradigm.

Brett:

Sure, sure. Well, let's dive into psychology then let's dive into, you know, mental health is massive. Something that's obviously gaining traction, I think. Thank goodness within the United States and I'm sure with in Canada as well, as far as just having the conversation and people being aware and people being open to listening, but for you, how did you get started? Kind of doing that self exploration to, you know, become more aware of who you truly were. What did that look like for you?

Ben:

Okay. So I think the, to obviously my background's pretty crazy, right? when you, when you go through trauma, it's pretty extreme, but there's a lot of people that don't go through trauma that desperately need mental health as well. It's not like, well I didn't live in the streets. I wasn't a drug addict. So it's hard to right. Get worried when I share my story that people don't relate. I know my, my crew, my, my, my trauma guys, they all relate to me. But they, the thing is though being, but so here's the thing I think intrinsically inside your soul, there's something that says I am Ben

Ben:

And I'm out of alignment.

Brett:

Right?

Ben:

I am Brett I'm out of alignment. And so what that means is I look at a chiropractor, right? Say your backs out, you can still operate pretty good. Yeah. Like, and then you do this I can't for, so we create mental frameworks that say, you know what? There's guy, there's kids starving in Africa. Yeah. What do I gotta worry? No, like we it's just because you don't know how to get through that process. I think we have one singular mission and it's to be me, I think at the core of everything inside us, there's one mission. It's to be my best version. Ben. Yeah. And so I started and I wasn't, I was beat up as a kid unfair. And I had to try to get back to Ben. Yeah. And so by doing that, you have to say, why do I do these things?

Ben:

But when you're really good and your life's pretty good, you don't do those questions. And you don't realize though on the I other side of not too bad or a good life is a amazing life that we're, we've been settling for so long settling my wife and I just moved from Alberta to the west coast. And I'm looking at the ocean. I did that. I got to do that to do the sunset. The sun rise this morning was wild. Wild. I got, I was at the beach hanging out there before coming to talk to you. I feel good. I didn't know how good it could be. But I knew in my heart that I was out of alignment, living in Edmonton, Alberta, it was not my home at a, at a subconscious deep level. I knew I was out of alignment. So what I started doing in life, I thought, how do I just build a life?

Ben:

I remember just wanting to die every day as a kid. And I, and I, and I got out of my rehab center and I just thought, man, if my wife, if I could get a wife that loves me, some kids that run to me, I would be happy. It was so simple back then. So simple. And I realized, wow, it's still simple today. And I realized that I just need to be mean because when I'm in alignment, gets good. It gets easier. Money comes to me. Relationships are healthy, cool people. I attract amazing people that are like my journey, which is people that wanna be the best versions of themselves. But if I'm bitter all attract bitter people, it's, we're a magnet to bring in ourselves. So, so it wasn't a one day thing. It just, I started getting whole and getting more aligned to who I need to be in my life, who I was designed to be.

Ben:

I don't know. Why do people think about it? Why do people jump on a piano and they know how to play and they ever take lessons. Why, what is your thing? Like, why do I wanna talk? <Laugh> I don't know. I was told, I talked too much. My whole life screw you all. That was my destiny. Screw you all. This is who I am. I have t-shirts now I make, say, I believe in me, I got another t-shirt that says, says, let my story, let my, let my story speak for me. Okay. Let you know, let my actions tell the story. Right? And so I think the ultimate thing, even for real estate agents, this might get a little Harry fairy people that like this love this, but the people that are like, what the hell? Let's talk about strategy. How'd you make a million bucks. How you make a million dollars is to step one.

Brett:

Okay.

Ben:

Self awareness when you meet with self you'll win every listing because they feel the energy they feel off you is amazing. They can trust you. They're gonna be safe with you. You'll be able to hear people because you're out of your freaking head thinking. Whoa, did I do a good job? What am I gonna say today? No, you don't do those things when you're actually self-aware and confident. So yes. It ties back to how well you can convert sales on every level but you gotta be yourself. I know it sounds meme-like, but it's real. It's really what are you designed to be? And where are you out of alignment?

Brett:

Yeah. No. And that, and that makes sense. And I think self-awareness is the key to success in anything, whether it be real estate or you know, personal growth or you know, whatever your career is in. But self-awareness I think is something that ultimately most people think they have, but they don't truly, and, they never want to take that time because it's not easy. It's not easy to do that inner work and really explore yourself. Which sounds like one, one of the barriers.

Ben:

Yeah, yeah It might not be as hard as people think. And I catch myself saying the same thing you just did. It's like, yeah, it's not easy, but I'm like, hold on a second. Like maybe that's a framework that we've built a society that maybe it's not as hard as you think. And so I think when we say those things, we instantly create a resistance it's like, it's like, Hey, eat this cake. Oh man, it's gonna be so hard to eat that cake. Oh really? No dude just eat the cake. So I find that I find that the psychology world has made it long, drawn-out, impossible to get through. And I think we need to be checking in on our framework of how we think of human growth. For example, I'll give a tip right now that some good start right now when you react, not think when you react, that's the doorway to start looking right. And just say, Hey, why did I get mad there? What happened? Why did I, why did I go quiet there? And you just start asking questions and you, oh, that's way cool. I'm normal in the conversation. That's not being normalized. So anyway, I just think it's just, I didn't mean to interrupt you, Brett.

Brett:

No. I'm glad you said that.

Ben:

Okay.

Brett:

I'm really glad that you said that

Ben:

It might not be as hard as people think I'm seeing changes constantly in my world quick it's not, it's not for real. They're not, they don't have to take that long.

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After the break, Ben and I talk more about mindfulness, what an energy audit is, and how creating systems for your business can help you become more efficient.

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Brett:

Okay. So it seems like, you know, the practice of being mindful for you is, has been a long journey. You said you're in your forties now. Is there something that you do every single day that helps you kind of frame that mentality? Or is it just at this point it's become so natural that you don't have to think about it as much.

Ben:

I think we have to look at our motivations. Okay. So we look at routines. So what we're talking about is like what, it's your daily routine. We love these questions. Right? What's the secret. You, you make a billion, you make a hundred trillion. What's your secret? Well, I get up in the morning, take a. And then what I do, like what do you wanna know? Like it's I think the 5:00 AM club, maybe that's it. But what if you're a nighttime person? Right? Like I feel like, I feel like life is really custom fit to everyone differently, but I get it. So let's talk about motivations. Okay. Okay. What's your secret bend for losing 30 pounds secret? I just found out that I was gonna get diabetes.

Ben:

It's the ultimate weight loss plan. You get diagnosis. It that you're about to get diabetes in the next few months. If you don't lose weight, do we have to Google? How at that point we have to. We never do because what we need to do is not how what's your routine. We're asking the wrong questions. It's what's your motivation behind what you do. Okay. Like why are you doing a podcast? Why do you wake up every day? Why are you like, what is driving human beings? I love of that conversation because that's where we can see real change. Like, oh I'm how many guys do this? Oh man, I can't wait. I'm gonna do a podcast. I'm gonna start a podcast and no one ever does. You know why? And they've Googled it. They've taken the downloaded. The $99 course. They've hired a coach and they still have not done it. Do you know why? Cause they don't want to.

Brett:

Yeah. Deep down.

Ben:

They don't want to. And they don't have enough motivation. So as a coach, a a, a good coach, like you can have a trainer and a teacher, but a coach is someone that calls you out on your.

Ben:

And, and the thing is, I just say, you know, do you really wanna be a podcaster? Oh, I've got this amazing idea. I'm gonna start door knocking. Okay, cool. You ready for 18 months? Oh like, it's just like, it's just the ideas and the, the questions you so, so, so what's my secret is that, is that I really look at what, why what's my, why behind what I do and it, if it's not a good enough, why now here's the thing. Most of 'em are adopted. So in, in the real estate reboot camp that we coach coach in six months, the very first session is mandatory. They can unlock the entire course called setting compass. <Laugh> it's a very, because people, man, how many times I sit down with an agent and they're like, yeah, I want 50 deals. What's 50. Everyone's 50 deals.

Ben:

Okay. Hundred, 200. But 50 seems to be the most common 50 deals. Like, okay, cool. I can help you with that. No problem. Absolutely way higher than that. Okay. I can show you that. Cool. So what are you gonna spend your money on? What do you mean? Oh no, no. Obviously you've done a life plan and you've priced out what your life's gonna beand how much it's gonna be. And you obviously need, you know, about eight, $900,000 to live the life that you want. And they look at me and they're like, oh, I see what you're doing. Cause the truth is what do you really need? And what do you want? Like the pretty awesome life's 3 5400. That's a pretty awesome life. Yeah. 400 is 1%. Yeah, no, they, we, million is goofy because 400,000 is the 1% of the world.

Ben:

Right. The world. Like if you're over a board, like it's like, you can't build a life with that. <Laugh> and so they're like life, what are you talking about? My brokers giving me all the awards and there's the Titan award with Remax and that's 800,000. And there's this award with and it's like, hold on. So my big thing is what, what goals have you adopted that aren't yours. You'll never get to the end of the race with goals. Okay. Because they're not what you want. Yeah. Have you ever, have you ever told a kid to go clean his room? Do you have kids, Brent? No, I do not. No. Okay. Guess what? If you ever a kid get him to clean the room. It's hard, but watch this. What if I told the kids you know, you have to clean your room. We need, we need to teach you discipline and be a good human being.

Ben:

Not enough motivation there. Right? There's not enough motivation. They don't wanna clean the room. Why clean the room? It's fine. I pick up my pants right off the floor and wear 'em twice. What's the big deal. And the thing is, but what if you told the kid tomorrow morning, we're going to Disneyland. We gotta get at three 30 in the morning. You gotta have your room clean to be done in two seconds. Right? So we have to look at what our motivations are and you have to, and the kid wants to go to Disneyland. They want to, but if you wanna be more disciplined, that's not a good, I wanna be less procrastination like it. Those aren't good motivations. Those are what you like. I wanna lose 10 pounds, but I feel pretty happy with my 10 pounds. I get to live with it.

Ben:

My pants still fit <laugh> so you need a diabetes, you need something that actually is gonna motivate you. So when you think of a, like, how do you Mo I think that's a conversation that needs to be happening. What are you actually building? Yeah. Like, oh, I wanna, half a million dollars is just a hammer. So why do you need a hammer? I don't know, but I got a nice hammer. I want a gold-plated one. It's like, why do you need it? Yeah. And I'm not against it. I wanna swim in money, dude. Let me have a good swim in it. I want trillions, but not, not disconnected to what I really want though. Right? Like I'm not saying only make 200. I'm saying make as much money as you can but not sacrifice what you really want. Sure.

Ben:

And that's what has to happen. That conversation needs to happen. So, anyone that comes into my world, the first thing we do is set your compass. because what makes you happy? <Laugh> what are your financial goals and lay, layover your financial goals to your personal goals, lay them over. And you'll realize I've done this to hundreds of agents. Everyone says big numbers. I want 300. I want a million. I want this. I said, cool. Once you get there, what are you gonna get? What are, what are you gonna do? They're like, oh, I'm gonna wake up in the morning and have a team on my Del team. I'm gonna go to the gym. I'm like, so they're trying to solve worry and a sense of security. They don't need security they don't, they want sense of security. So that's why they're mixing practical solutions, thinking it's gonna solve the emotional ones.

Brett:

Sure.

Ben:

But what if we solve the sense of security, then go into the business. What happens? Like it changes the plan. And I think people are really scared to lose their motivation because subconsciously they know it's from a very, maybe it's anger or maybe it's into security. What maybe they're scared of actually the drive going away. And I don't know why because they could be happy. Right? So I'm, I'm a different guy. I don't fit everybody, but that's kind of where that's, that's the, that's the reason I, every single day I wake up and I ask, I ask why I do what I do and is what I, what I, every single thought is that thought mind that I adopt that thought is that thought mind that has that thought strengthen me. Does that weaken me? Why did I react that way? am I doing what I love?

Ben:

What can I do today to actually make my energy just skyrocket? Cause when you show up on the, when you show up playing football and the guys hung over, how good is he on the field has nothing to do with talent, right? It has everything to do with your energy. So I think that's something we need to really pay attention to is our energy. Are you getting it? Where are you getting drained? Who's draining you. What activities are draining you in our course, we do an energy audit for that reason. We need to get rid of the things that drain you and make those changes.

Brett:

I like that energy audit. I don't think I've ever heard that before, but I really like that idea. Can you expand on that a little bit?

Ben:

Sure. The actual thing we do is one of the courses we run and one of our, in, in one of the sessions, we run to do business energy out at first. So we list out every single thing in your entire business, like everything, and then ask yourself beside it. Does it strengthen you or does it weaken you or is it neutral? And then when you look at that whole thing, you're gonna go, there's the job description for who you need to hire and, and then we need, so that's one thing. And because like, think about me doing bookkeeping, how much bookkeeping I do in one hour? Well probably nothing. because I would complain and wanna die the whole time. But if I hired a bookkeeper to do one hour's worth of work that I was gonna spend, she'd probably do 15 hours worth of the same amount of work in an hour.

Brett:

Right.

Ben:

We, we don't, this is called thinking like a business owner. Okay. That's a massive deal. Self-Awareness again, but now you go into the other part, the actual energy audit is all, it starts like this there's like a whole session on it. But the, the, the, the assignment I do is I actually get them to think about standing naked in front of the mirror.

Brett:

<Laugh>

Ben:

And I say, look at your belly, rate it from one to 10 and exactly what goes through your head. Look at your legs, look at your face, your skin, your chest. And I literally go through this weird process where we actually just, just simply starting from the self image and usually it's,

Brett:

Right?

Ben:

There's maybe one or two things they like and the rest of it's. So now you're running around this world thinking I'm at a subconscious level, thinking I'm your first choice. You're gonna wanna choose me. It's a, it's a contradiction to the subconscious. So you're running around and then you feel the emptiness. Then you feel something. Well, then you get really frustra and depressed. Well, you have a relationship with yourself. That's never being talked about. That's one thing. Then we do the 10 most influential relationships in your life. Rate them from, rate them from one, one to 10, 10 being strengthens you and fires you up like crazy. And one being totally tears you down and steals all the energy. You wanna see something crazy. You can see exactly what's going on, energetically in your circle of influence. Sure. So this is, there's a few things else we do, but this is, this is the stuff that unlocks the doubles and the triples in business that, that people aren't seeing that it's actually connected. You can, can, does this make sense, Brett?

Brett:

Oh yeah, no, I'm following you, man. Yeah. When you, when you talked about the mirror exercise, what I was thinking or what kind of popped in my head was this accountability mirror, which is something that David Goggins had talked about. Okay. How, when he felt out of a, out of that kind of, that misalignment that you were talking about, he would stand in the mirror and have this big self conversation about you're failing on this. You could be doing better with this. This is that it was big, he called it, your accountability mirror. And that's kind of what reminded me of that, of you need to, again, it comes back to focusing on yourself and working on yourself before, you know, doing anything else to, you know, get the success that you ultimately want is you have to be self-accountable and be honest with yourself.

Ben:

Is the word, dude. Right? I wrote down as you're speaking honesty. <Laugh> no, because, because people think positivity, like, like it's really good just to clarify this because standing in the mirror and just imagine a beautiful woman. Okay. But she's lost a hundred pounds. She's standing there in the mirror and, and, and, and, and, or let's just let me just forget the mirror. She's there's, there's a hundred people lined up in a room. One at a time walks up. She has a deep sense that she still feels fat, but she's beautiful. Right? There's that she doesn't feel beautiful. She's physically gorgeous. Now she's done all kinds of stuff to her body. Now we walk up to her, let's get a hundred people using positivity and looking at her and go, you're beautiful. You're one of a kind. And we do this now for an hour, a hundred people in a row. You know, what's funny. It doesn't matter the words when you feel fat,

Brett:

Right?

Ben:

We're not, we're not dealing with the, so she needs to be like, Hey, I feel fat. If, if she goes, Ben, I feel fat. I go, then you're fat. That's what I would say to that lady. Oh, you can't say that. I'm like, well, that's what she thinks. And I'm not trying to be mean, but why would I give? Because here's what happens. You're beautiful. You're beautiful. You're beautiful. I feel fat. I should feel beautiful. That's massive. Self-Judgment positive movement is creating the most self-judgment hands down because then what happens is I, it should be working. I've told myself I'm beautiful and it's not working. Maybe I don't have enough positive thoughts. Outweighing the negative thoughts. It is absolute self-hatred. You're creating that way so when, when they hear about Goggins looking at himself, honestly, that's the hack. You don't need positivity. We want honesty that's self-awareness again.

Ben:

Like, it's not judgment though. Like if you're looking at yourself going, I'm a fat SL or if I say, yeah, I'm 20 pounds overweight, two different things,

Brett:

Right.

Ben:

One is like, you can't, you need to look at yourself, honestly. And if you do judgment, so it's game over. Like, you're just, you might as well just, you know, you're gonna never gonna make it.

Brett:

You're digging yourself a mental ditch.

Ben:

Totally.

Brett:

So you had mentioned when you were expanding on this energy audit about, you know, having this mindset of a business owner, let's dive into what it means to, you know, have a business owner versus worker mindset.

Ben:

Yeah. I love it. Love it. I think this is desperately what the industry needs. So like if I came to your restaurant and I walked up to you and says, Hey, Brett, we're buddies. And I'm like, dude, I just got the best restaurant, best location. So busy. It is a moneymaker. It, I, I bought it for a million. It has already created a million in revenue. It's gonna be a one-year hundred percent ROI. It's gonna be amazing. Okay. Awesome. But here, you know what, I'm gonna save a little bit of money. Okay. And you know what, you know me, I'm a hard worker, Brett, you know, I can do it. I'm gonna, I'm gonna actually, I'm gonna do the hosting, serving, cooking. And afterwards I can clean up because it's after hours, you know, I only need a book two and a half hours sleep. I can crush. And so, and so, oh yeah. The parking lot, the marketing, the, the bookkeeping, the hiring, the firing, the, the legal work. Okay. I, you know what, I can do it. That's in worker's mentality. And when you see it in a restaurant setting, what would you say to me if I came and said that to you

Brett:

Sound insane, truthfully.

Ben:

Yeah. That's what I say. Every single agent almost when they say, wow, oh, I'm gonna, same thing. You have to sell houses, list houses. You have paperwork to do. You've got reporting to do. You've got bookkeeping taxes, which most don't do. But the way you've gotta, like, what about, what about this pictures, videos like we're talking and, and also a restaurant has they eat and leave with a real estate transaction. It takes minimum 90 days to get paid. You gotta have a system to keep growing your base and taking care of the base and keeping the 20 years. No wonder no one keeps them because they're all freaking employee mindsets.

Brett:

Right? Yeah. And it comes down to time. Like how much are you willing to, you know, time is money is obviously that's said a lot, but we had a previous guest on who had also expanded on this point and talked about how, ultimately, especially within real estate, it's that face to face interaction. That's gonna ultimately build the business. So if you're behind a desk doing the bookkeeping or you're in the parking lot, cleaning up, well, you could be serving people and building that relationship to have that the low oil customers. What, why would you, why would you not do that? Why would you not spend all of your time doing what truly builds your business when you could hire people to

Ben:

Okay.

Brett:

Let's that's the other stuff. Yeah.

Ben:

Why they all know it. Everyone I talk to says, yeah, totally. I'm with you, man. Yeah. You bet. I shouldn't be doing the $15 an hour jobs. You bet. So what's the problem. This is what I'm trying to say. <Laugh> you tell me what is it? We can talk about it all day and be like, yep. We got just se 17 steps to running a business changer. It's all data. Yeah. So why are we not doing it? Do you know why it's personal growth? It's inner game. It's emotional friction. It's scared of scared of conflict. It's people pleaser. There's real emotional things. It's emotional intelligence. For example. Okay. I would someone I've coached. And I said, look, you're already making two, 300 grand a year. You're crushing. You're like really doing everything. Well, what you need is to freaking turn your hustle into a business.

Ben:

I said, you need to hire, she goes, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh my goodness. I so need a you're so right. I'm gonna get on it months. Go by what? The freak didn't you hire, you have money. You have the knowledge, you know, everything finally dig into it. I had one last time and it didn't work. So now we're dealing with an emotional thing saying I don't wanna feel bad. I rather not do it than again. because I have an issue with fear of failure. We gotta get into the emotional unwinding. We gotta figure it out so the only, so the thing is though, she was so stuck that we had a bad experience that she doesn't wanna do it again. It's easier just to work her off. And so if I was to tell her how to hire it didn't work. It didn't it's like us talking about it.

Ben:

People like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like, well you don't do nothing. What? The freak? I don't wanna, I wanna live a life filled with purpose and impact. That means I've gotta help people actually execute. Not just tell 'em how smart and cool ideas and change their thinking a little bit. We need to execute. So here's, I'll give, I'll give the audience a really good hack right now because we that's. I'm like, well, how I'm that's all I spend my time on. How do I get you over you without having to change you? Like let's work with, with tools that you have and execute now, instead of doing some psychology for 10 years to work your out. No, no, no, no. Let's build the business. And that actually what's is what works out. The psychology. My forward motion is always the end answer.

Ben:

When you go look in the closet, the Monster's not there. There's no other way to convince someone that the Monster's not there without opening that door and looking in the closet. So that's what I'm trying to help people do is go look in the closet. So here's the thing. Let's talk about hiring. Okay. Let's go. Let's give these people who are listening right now. Exactly what to do and I'll help them do it right now. So let's go do this. First of all, let's build the motivation first. Not because everyone wants to hire, but why I'm busy? No, no, no. Watch this. What if we just, and, and let's, let's say this. How many deals do people miss? because of a lack of follow on. Just go real basic here. Most people at least are 10 and let's say it's an expensive market or it's like $10,000 a sale.

Ben:

It's a hundred grand. So I said, okay, I can. So they're like, oh my goodness, I've missed so many sales. That's the thing about coaching. They're thinking of getting sales. I look at what you're losing. Right? We don't actually have to do any lead gen. We just gotta, we just gotta get you to follow up on your base and there, and, and that's like literally a phone call or an email or a text. And they're like, yeah, I'm just so busy. So the motivation is let's try to capture the a hundred grands. Perfect. Then you don't have to be as busy then you don't have to see building the why. because the mission is that you want to be home in the weekends with your family. Right? Bam. Now we've gotta bit of a system there to get motivation. Then I say this, okay, let's run the number.

Ben:

So a hundred grand. We're trying to get that's 10 sales. Let's run the numbers. Let's say $15 an hour. So let's do this 15 bucks an hour times, five days a week, times 52 is that right? $3,900, $3,900. What we wanna do you is this one hour a day. You hire someone. So instead of thinking, hire an assistant that triggers all the emotional friction oh, what am I gonna do with them? How much do I pay them? How do I train them? There's so much. No, no, no, no, no. If we take that road, you'll do nothing. So I have to get their mindset to 1% closer to business owner. So I, I do project hiring, hire the project. You don't have to worry about taxes, employee, payroll, nothing. We're talking start where they're at. Like hiring assistant is so intimidating. Right?

Ben:

It's hard. So what we're doing is we're jumping 'em right to triple black belt. No, no, no. Let's move them forward as the goal. This is what coaches, miss they really do. They're like, here's the PDF. I did it. Yeah. After 15 years of trial and error, now you have a PDF and you think they're gonna be able to do it. There's no way. So what we do is one jaw. You have a babysitter, I'm a hack, man. I wanna get to the money and get to my life as fast as I can. So hire someone to babysit you, to make sure you do fall calls. So you do a CMA. They say, call me in a couple months. We can probably list with you. We forget to call 'em. Yeah. $10,000 plus all the referrals. It's crazy. So what we want is this one person one hour, a day, $15 an hour. BA sorry. $30 an hour. We love to swear. Cause I just did a, oh,

Brett:

You're fine. If, if anything, I can edit stuff out.

Ben:

So don't worry about it. Way, way late on that question. <Laugh> OK. So, so that's what you do. I'll just sorry. What, you do is hire someone for $15 to look at your list, which is not ever taken care of. their only singular job is to get to know the prospects that you're working with and get to know your clients. Okay? The only job they need to do is bug you. Hey Ben, I know it's six o'clock at night. You're probably home with your family, but there's this one call that you've gotta make, get it done. So it's a $15 an hour job. One hour a day. You can do a lot of work in one hour, now for $3,900, you buy yourself the 10 leads that you lost.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

That's why don't we just raise your income by a hundred grand people would, they would pay me 50 grand for that, that one tip is 50 worth $50,000. I'm like here, I'll do one coaching session with you. Heck I'll even help you hire the person. Give me 50 grand. I'll make you a hundred.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

See people complicate things, Brad. And so that's where I, my motive is not the money. To be honest, money's never, the motive. Motive is that I'm gonna get their freedom. I'm actually going after their freedom because they don't want money. They want freedom. They know it's always, always, always, they think money buys freedom. It really doesn't it's money buys. Anybody's busyness the way they're doing it. The actually is the opposite. Very opposite. As they grow their business, they get busy because they didn't build a business and they're not tied to what they really want. So they just start rolling. Yeah. And the very thing they're looking for is freedom. And so with one hour and $3,900 a year, it's like, you can make a hundred grand.

Brett:

Well, yeah. And when you break it down that's to that at simplest form, it sounds like, oh of course. Of course. Why wouldn't I, why wouldn't I, but then like, like you had said with, yeah, like you said, with all your examples of nobody ever actually does it, nobody sits down and just does it. That's crazy.

Ben:

So then you could look at your own life. It's this is why co I actually coach other businesses too here and there. Oh, okay. It's like, it's like 85%. That real estate. Right? I coach executives, same thing happens. Right? They're busy in the same business. This is the same thing. What do you want? You know, and how do we get it? Cool. Now let's build your business toward that. How do we buy your time? What's draining you. Yeah. Let's fix that. So now you're twice as productive and on your stuff. And that job that you were doing is 10 times more productive. Cause you're not doing it. You know? It's like, like editing a podcast.

Brett:

Yeah, no you right. You

Ben:

Hit the it's raining like crazy man. And most guys don't want edit podcasts. No. It's time takes time. How about a perfectionist editing a podcast versus a non perfectionist. See what the psychology is? The biggest hack

Brett:

It makes sense though. But it makes sense. But again, it just comes back to not people don't wanna take the time to explore that.

Ben:

Well, it's scared of what they find because we've made it so scary. It's not like, Hey dude, I still yell at my kids sometimes. Guess what though? That's okay see the problem is that the problem is this that we beat the living out of ourselves. We hide who we are and then you're like, holy crap. If they knew who I am, they're not gonna like me. Oh my goodness. So you have this internal trap. I'm normalizing. And I'm being the Guinea pig. Yeah. You're right. Sometimes I will read sometimes. Yes, but I'm still winning we don't like perfection. Are you kidding me? I'm a D D HD. I got 'em all man. I barely can read I'm dyslexic and look legit. And, and it's like, it's like, you know what though, man, I, I don't have to change me. I just gotta be me. And I think confidence is misunderstood because I think they gotta be Goggins is the only problem with that. See such a high level. We're chasing the high level rather than just being you. It's not good enough is the problem. You're not good enough the way you are. That's. All our life. We've been told all our life we've been told, then we're not good enough.

Brett:

And it's funny

Ben:

Master your craft. Why master your craft? What if I'm good enough? Enjoy life. Yeah. Different.

Brett:

No, it's funny you say that. because even he will touch on that. He's like, don't try and be me. He's like be the best version of you. He's like, you can't be me because I'm me. Yeah. But yeah, but it, but again, you're adopting all of these ideas of who you want to be, but it's not. That's truly what you want.

Ben:

Yeah. I run retreats four-day retreats, deep dives, four days, you leave your world, and you feel guilty for leaving your world, which is part of my process, and we take you to some beautiful locations in the world and we literally do deep dive on who you are, what you want. It's probably, I've been doing this now for 10 years. I've I've been doing it with being mentored and now mentoring this I've Mount my 10th retreat. I'm doing myself. I can't explain to you the power of leaving your world for three days and doing a deep dive into this stuff. Right? It's it's something that I've never seen such transformation in business is not working on your business,

Brett:

Right? Yeah. No, but that makes sense as being able to take a step back cause that's how, that's a great way to avoid that burnout. Like you were talking about earlier

Ben:

A hundred percent and then burnout costs people don't cost burnout. What's three months of you being at 20% energy worth

Brett:

Nothing.

Ben:

You're you're you're literally, I just talked to someone who just signed up to my program, his name's Graham and he is like he's like, yeah, I've done all the other coaches. I said, why are you calling me? <Laugh> he goes, well, he goes, he goes, I need they're all too nice. I need someone to really tell me. And I just honesty is missing. Right? Cause people have a side motive if you're being too nice, that's because you don't wanna lose their money or you don't want the reputation to change. You don't want to. So you just keep 'em going. Well, my motive is leave or come. I don't care. I want change.

Brett:

Right,

Ben:

I don't want you in my world. Get outta my world. If you're hiring me to coach you, we're gonna see production. We're gonna send not sales. We're gonna see an openness in real changes and we're gonna give what you want. And so he, he just signed up and but it was the inner game he wants to talk about because he's tried everything it's just happening. It's happening more and more. So it's cool to see. It's cool to see what's happening. Sure.

Brett:

And I'm so your, from your perspective, over time, you've kind of seen that growth and seen more and more people kind of hit that. Aha. Themselves of I've done everything that I thought I should do <laugh> or that previous coaches have told me to do, but it's not worked. There's gotta be something left that. And it's, you know, it's in here.

Ben:

Well, it's simply saying this, I think this, if you compare me to all the other coaches I'm not saying they're bad at all. Right? Like they're great. The thing is though, they focus on building a race car for you.

Brett:

Right.

Ben:

And they give you an instruction manual. Exactly. The best tires, the best systems and all this stuff. But no, one's teaching how to become an amazing driver. That's what I do. And so if, but now I got, I think I got an advantage because guess why you take any race car driver? You put him in any car

Brett:

,

Ben:

, he's gonna win or get close to it. So we, we, they think the best car is the, the way to win. Nope. Would you take the best car or the best driver? It's just like, it's a simple answer.

Brett:

Well, yeah, you, you look at, at F1, they have these amazing, amazing cars, but like you had just said, what's more important is the driver behind it. You could have,

Ben:

It always is.

Brett:

You could have the Mercedes Petros, but if you throw a no name driver who has no mental health, the guy's not gonna win any races for you. Nope. You're losing no of

Ben:

That's the story of business right there. My friend. That's why

Brett:

Hamilton

Ben:

<Laugh> the, the, the reality is I'm getting that constantly. It speak. I almost, I, I laughed at the last person that called me to, for coaching. And we talked to him. I, I started laughing. I said, I gotta explain 'em I'm not laughing at you. I just said, it's so cliche that I've got the same conversation. I won't drop their names, but I've tried this guy, this guy, this guy, we're talking 30, $40,000 of coaching, like 10 grand here, 10 grand here. And, and it's like, it's like, and it's like, they're just, they, they are so smart. But the problem is that they, they don't understand how to get the person to actually execute. Like even that example of how do you hire an assistant? I can teach you that. No, no, no. $15. Could you afford that? Yeah. Okay. Get someone to do one thing in your business.

Ben:

Now I can, now it get just understanding a different, you gotta grow that person. Once that happens, that's why we get long term results. Short term is flashing the pan. Here's your car. Like if you can really grow the person, but it's those moments that happen on the inside that change everything forever. I'd like to explain traditional coaching is this jump on the call. Okay, great. What are your goals? Awesome. Yep. Cool. What did you do to get to your goals? Great. Okay. Here's a couple strategies you use. Okay, good. See you next week. That's coaching. That's not coaching. You should not pay for an accountability partner. You should not get your buddy to do that truthfully and oh, you can have my whole library of all my systems. Here's the library card. Where do I start? Just go look around. Like, it's not.

Ben:

It's like, okay. And so, so the thing, so when that's, that's that's accountability, coaching and you don't have someone to be like, really put the microscope on you. And that's that's and like you said, I don't know how many people are really wanting that until the pain is enough. They show up. And that's why we're seeing a lot of the coaches doing the same stuff. And now with P know, E P growing, it's all, everyone's a coach now. Yeah. Like it's a really interesting thing. That's happening. I got no problem. I coach I coach HP agents I'm I, I even teams use me as their main training. But so nothing against E P but the model is a recruiting model. So what's happening is everyone's now being a coach.

Brett:

Sure.

Ben:

Because why would you not, if you're a team lead, I'm gonna coach you. I'm gonna coach you. I'm gonna coach you. But the thing is though, that's, it's a really interesting thing because it's gonna water down the entire coaching industry. Cause everyone's a coach. It's gonna change the, so it's in the midst of, and there's nothing wrong with the, with the business. It's just that it's that, it's just interesting to see that the, that everyone's a real estate coach now and what's gonna happen is it's just the same stuff. Hey, you want a door knock? Here's three objections. How you do it. Okay, great. You want, why aren't you doing it? Yeah, because you have a fear of rejection. My friend they don't don't need to learn how to door knock. They need to learn the fear of rejection. Once you fear rejection, they forget don't walk to every seek, go supermarket and go pick up deals. It's everywhere.

Brett:

Yeah. So I think I know what your answer will be to this question, but I'd like to ask it anyway. What do you think has been the biggest factor for you within building like a lasting career? One in real estate, but now in coaching,

Ben:

You know what? I, we treat people like humans, first of all not like a transaction. You spend the time to really hear them. Sure. And understand them. And, and genuinely it's the mission is impact. Like if I work with someone it's personal to me, like I've to everyone on my team. It's personal. We're not here to make a transactional here personal. And I feel like if we can focus on one at a time, make a human connection without worrying about the sale, you will see what happens over time.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

No matter what industry you're at, if you're at a restaurant or restaurant owner called you on your birthday, not just give you a little discount card, be like, Hey, I own Boston pizza. And I know that's that's might be impossible. Or like, I just wanted to Chicago, deep dish, I guess yours. And, and, but imagine I'm the owner of Chicago deep dish, Brett, I've noticed that you were at my restaurant. I noticed that your birthday, I just wanna say how much I appreciate you coming and eating my pizza. What would you say, Brett? Would you ever go anywhere else after that?

Brett:

No, I'd be, I'd be a customer for life.

Ben:

Hello? What the F are we doing that in some way? Has to be done. , this is called 1925 business. Sure. And it's the ultimate hack right now? Cause everything is about optimization websites, lead gen drip, you know, like the lead magnets and yes, it is important. I have that but without the thing where they say, Brett, I deeply care for your money. You send to me your business and how's your kids, Brett. How's it. Are you ever gonna have kids? How's the girl. How's the boy. Like what about that? Somehow that's the ultimate hack to business it's missing. And I'm gonna say one thing. Okay. Go for it. I'll give, I've never given this yet, but here's my prediction. So do you know what the used car salesmen guy is?

Brett:

Oh yeah. The typical stereotype.

Ben:

That's a branded thing. Okay. As a society, we have agreed on a branding of a human that's a SL ball. Okay. <Laugh> because he'll say anything he has to do to sell you some pieces of. As long as he gets paid old school, right? Yeah. That, that had to get created.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

What happened for 15 years or 10 years before that was guys learned how to manipulate to get the sale. Now here's the thing. My generation at 42 we're we've rejected that beyond rejected that we've all been burnt. We've all bought the vacuum at the door. e know how it works and we rejected it for 15 to 20 years. Guess what's back closers.

Ben:

Yeah, it is unreal. Mark. My word. Okay. We were back to growing used car sales, grant Cardone Daniel lock. Some of these powerhouses are teaching closers. And I'm looking at this saying, I know hardcore manipulative sales training, and I'm not saying they're all like that. Okay. But I know that people don't like it losers. You need a closer, this is now pre Quill in 10 years. We're gonna hate their gut. If not five years, I'm playing the hedge bet. And I agree everyone else should, as I'm betting that I'm gonna be the guy, the relationship first guy that will win the game. At the end, we have the tortoise and the hair happening right now. The hairs are gonna come out like flying, making millions. They're gonna do these things. And it's gonna be really hard to focus on long game relationship building until the world rebrands, the used car salesman. As the closer you watch what's gonna happen. So if we want to build now is the most incredible time to play the odds on relationships because it is now mainstream on closers. Cause high ticket coaching, all these things. If you can close sales, find a guy with the high ticket closing or product and go sell for them. So it's an industry that's coming back. If the new used car salesman will be the closure,

Brett:

Like the Michael Barry betting against it. Oh <laugh> looked watch the movie the big short and you'll it's. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. So, that was all based off Michael Barry, you know, essentially betting against the yeah. The housing market for the,

Ben:

I truly believe with, because I'm an old school salesman. My dad was a door-to-door salesman. I was in it. I was trained in it and it, I rejected on every level from a human to human interaction to sell stuff. Sure. But human to human interaction. Yeah. I think in the day of, of a, of a non-connected connected world, right? People are more desperate for a real human connection than ever in the history of time. There's more people desperate because they look at you and they think they know you. They look at you. We can, I can put images up on Facebook. I can brand my life. So no one actually knows who they are and I think this is, or if we can really get to know human beings, like you, I said, if deep, just pizza called you, I would be a customer for life. What if we go after that?

Brett:

Right.

Ben:

That is where we need to obsess in business.

Brett:

That makes sense. But, and it, and it's that loss of connection is not just applied to, you know, sales techniques or real estate for that matter. I think there's everywhere. Huge loss of connection everywhere. I think.

Ben:

Well, we're in yeah,

Brett:

We're in it right now. That's for sure.

Ben:

Totally.

Brett:

So looking back at your career is one thing that you would go back and change and why? If there is anything,

Ben:

Man, I would've bet on me way faster.

Brett:

Sure.

Ben:

I would've bet on myself way faster. I think, I think that's the greatest loss of time and money I've ever seen ever is that we chase other people's. I should have just stepped in and spoke up and being my spoke my truth. I wish I would've been rejected 50 times faster than I was and got used to it. Yeah. I really believe that. I think going back and even today though, Brett, I look at that today. What am I doing? That's not, what am I hiding still? What am I because what if I'm giving myself this advice now I'm doing it now?

Brett:

Yep. <Laugh>

Ben:

Where do I need to be real more where, because I'm telling you that's the ultimate. Sure. It's the most, what it is, is it's attractive.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

And so if I was to go back and, and I, I, and the regrets would be, I wish I would've, I wish I could've heard my family more. In the midst of it. I know this, this serves a purpose, and I, you know, but I, I'm, I don't feel I missed anything in the way, but I definitely would've loved to be able to connect to what I wanted earlier.

Brett:

Okay.

Ben:

Way earlier. because then I wouldn't have done certain things. I wouldn't have needed 61 properties I've heard stopped at 20, kept a beautiful portfolio, and moved on and done something. But I did 61 properties in four different cities, just the drivenness. It was the cost of my family was high. Okay. And, and today we're in really good shape. So it's to hear, it's not a waste like we're in the best relationship I've ever had with my wife today, the best I've ever had in my life. Cause I'm willing to walk away from everything. Okay. Everything over my family.

Brett:

That's awesome to hear though. And I'm glad that you're at that spot.

Ben:

That's genuine.

Brett:

Yeah. It's

Ben:

Legit. I'll I'd live in a van. I don't care. <Laugh> I'd live in a van, but I would do it and then I would market it and then I would be living in a van with my family, having a good time and I'd be like, the van I don't. Yeah. Like just watch my life. I'll just go live it. Like I don't care. It's that's the coolest feeling in the world who cares.

Brett:

Yeah.

Ben:

I got what I, I know what I want.

Brett:

That's awesome. Well, I think that that's a great way to kind of end this episode, if there's, you know, anything that you want our listeners to you know, resource-wise, you had said earlier that you're working on a book right now. I dunno if that's supposed to be hush, hush or not.

Ben:

No. I just finished the, finish the manuscript today with my writer. It's going into, it's gonna be a final editing. It's called the richest real estate agent. Okay. It's the, it's the guide to building a seven-figure business without sacrificing your relationships. Okay. It's a mindset strategy book. Okay. Mindset first, grow the agent and then grow your business. That's just like what we're talking about. So that's coming out in March, I think March next year that'll be March 20, 22 for whenever someone's listening to it. Perfect.

Brett:

And then

Ben:

That's the book yeah.

Brett:

For your coaching business. Is there a website that you'd like to direct people to?

Ben:

You can go to Ben Oster be.com. I'm sure you'll have it linked, but Ben O yeah. O O S T E R V E L D. Okay. But, or the real estate reboot camp, real estate. That's a sales funnel, booking appointment. You probably have a good chance of talking to me directly. Okay. And, and it, it's not a sales call for me. It's let's see if I can help you. If we're a good fit, we're gonna dominate. We're gonna win. If we're not a good fit, I will push you away so fast because I don't want to have people in my world. I don't need the money. I wanna make impact. I'm looking for my tribe one at a time. Are you my tribe? Are you putting, are you taking what I'm putting down here? Maybe it's that moment. They're like, finally someone's talking. I get that a lot. Like, oh man. I don't know. You're different and man, you're different. That's my tribe finding me.

Brett:

That's awesome. Is there anything else that you'd like to point people to, or is that

Ben:

It's probably good man. Instagram, Instagram, Facebook find me. All I ask is say, if you like the podcast, let me know, makes me feel happy inside. And like I said, looking for my tribe one at a time who, who who's out there. I really, I really feel like that's a mission. I'm building a community for 20 years. People that wanna build a, an amazing business paid for by their life. By the way, around build a business, you know, that's really opposite. Let's that's dyslexic right there. So anyways, you wanna build an amazing life and you can pay for it by your business versus the other versus the other way around <laugh>

Brett:

Right, right, right. Yeah. Well, thanks again, Ben, this has been an awesome conversation. I've really enjoyed it. And you know, best of luck with everything coming up for you.

Ben:

Yeah. Thanks man. You're a great host, man. Thanks. Thank

Brett:

You.

Brett: That’s it for this episode, thanks for listening! If you enjoyed the podcast, you can subscribe to us and leave a review on your podcast player of choice. Shop Talk is a production of The CE Shop.